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Forum Index » Profile for thunderkyss » Messages posted by thunderkyss
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
Ok, I lied.

I have more to say on this subject. Right now, I'm testing StudioOneV2 & MagixMusicStudio2013, among others, to see which one I'll adopt as my DAW of choice.

I'm a registered V1.6 user, so my upgrade path is not $99, even if it were I'd most likely stick with Live (there's no upgrade path from LiveLite8 to LiveIntro9, I'd have to pay the full $99)

I'm a cheap bastid, I know that.

But VST support is important to me, track count is not. If I had to pay $99 for VSTi support, I would, but I don't have to, I have options. StudioOne is not one of those options, that's all I'm saying.

My Presonus Audiobox22VSL came with a version of StudioOneArtist that did not support VSTi and my StudioOne journey stopped there.

My MBox came with a version of Live that did support VSTi. At least one person I know bought the full version because of that (it wasn't me), I'm leaning towards LIve 9. Maybe that will lead someone else to buying Live. Or I might go with MagixMusicStudio2013, perhaps that will inspire someone to buy Samplitude.

Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
This will be my last point on the subject, then I'm moving on.

Maybe there should be another product all together aimed at the artist. Someone buying a Studio Live, or a DigiMax D8 would probably be the person looking for the current iteration of StudioOne Artist.

However, a person buying the smaller Audioboxes, is more than likely not going to "need" unlimited tracks, bussing options, insert effects, etc... But (s)he will most likely need VSTi & Rewire support.

Looking at most of PreSonuses products, I can see why they went with the current iteration of Studio Artist, most of it appears to be aimed at the project to pro studio market, & not the individual musician.
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
Gizzmo0815 wrote:

I'd wager that because Presonus includes Artist free with so many of their interfaces...they consider it basically a loss-leader product. Also don't forget the upgrade pricing, which is not bad at all. If you consider that Artist with an interface, is free (or extremely low cost) then Producer, with the upgrade price is actually only $100 for a full DAW with all the support you're asking for, and even more really. That's cheap for the product you're getting.


This is basically my point. Like I said, I got Ableton Live Lite 8 with my MBox2 Pro, as well as PTLE7.4 (long time ago), I got to playing around with AbletonLive Lite 8, & I liked what it had to offer. It is a great "scratch pad" for what I do at home, it's more than enough. A guy a regularly play with liked what I was able to do with it & he bought the full version. Now, I can do what I do, save my project on a thumb drive. At his place, he can load it into his system & we can take it further.

If at the time, I didn't get an MBox2 Pro & instead got an AudioBox22VSL, or a 44. I would have received StudioOneArtist & since I can't use Kontakt, or Battery, I simply won't go further into the program. Presence is cool, but unless it can read Kontakt or Battery files, I'm not interested.

I'm not going to play around in it as much. I'm not going to take it to my buddy's place to collaborate.

Let's say my buddy does everything with hardware synths & drum machines, & the limitations of StudioOne Artist doesn't affect him the way it does me. He comes to my house with his project on a thumbdrive. I'm still not "feeling" StudioOne, because I can't use my instruments to enhance what he's done. Instead, I'll copy his audio files into AbletonLive Lite, or ProTools 7.4, or Sonar 5, or Cubase Artist 5, or MagixMusicStudio 2013, then continue to work on his tune with my instruments.

Most of these DAWs, I either got free, or for less than $100 (Sonar being the exception, but since I've upgraded up to that point I don't think I ever spent more than $200 at any one time).

I'm currently looking for a DAW to call my own ( I never meshed with any of these & have been working with hardware sync'd to an AW4416, By hardware, I'm including Kontakt running standalone sequenced with a Roland Fantom-S, or an MV-8800). The 4416 is starting to become an issue & I'm liking the benefits of working in the box.

At the top of my list, is working with virtual instruments, pattern based sequencing/audio recording, tempo detection & correction. Pitch correction is starting to become a standard in even entry level applications, so it's also on my list, but not very high.

The things at the bottom of my list, included VST effects, I have no use for them, other than a parametric EQ, & a basic compressor. Anything more than 32 tracks is a plus for me, for years I've had 16 audio tracks, 16 midi tracks & I've never used them all. I've got 8 busses in the AW4416, never use any of them. I've got motorized faders, I never use any kind of automation.

All I want to do is play my music. Be able to cut it up into Verse, Intro, Chorus, etc... arrange it the way I want. Then record the song all the way through adding different parts if need be (organ, EP, Strings, etc...) But I want to use my instruments. I'm an artist, not an engineer, not a producer. An artist.
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
Gizzmo0815 wrote:

When you look at the whole line of products Presonus offers it's more than reasonable.

Try not to take this personal. StudioOne is a fine product & there are somethings they've done that I've thought, "Why hasn't anyone done this before." This on the other hand is one of those that left me scratching my head.

And price really isn't the issue. If it's worth it, people will pay. I've been to a few different forums in the last month or so asking users of other DAWs what features they thought their DAWs offered songwriters.

I realized....... DAWs aren't really made for musicians. Not even songwriters.

Someone on one of those forums pointed me towards StudioOne & it dawned on me I got a version of Artist with my AudioBox. So I went to their website & read what they had to say about Artist.
Unlike other “entry-level” DAWs, it imposes no limits on track count and plug-in instantiations, or editing features.

Honestly, I've never had a problem with trackcounts, even Ableton's 8 tracks. For me, once you go past 8 tracks, it's time to go to the studio. Think about it. Who needs 120 tracks, 10 busses, & 10 insert effects per track, & 13 stereo outputs for a scratchpad.

Now imagine you buy a Zoom R16, or a Tascam DP-004. Think about what limitations you will have. How do you think it would sell, if they said it didn't work with acoustic instruments, that you could only record instruments that put out -4db? wouldn't make sense would it? But if they said you don't have any effects busses, or only had 3 effects...... I think that would be more reasonable, more expected.

Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
For $99 Sonar gets you full VST/VSTi support, 64 audio tracks, unlimited midi tracks, & you can even import video.

Again, not trying to be difficult. Just trying to help Presonous do something different & offer something musicians need at a relatively "fair" price. So we aren't paying for things we'll never use.

Those guys who are interested in multitracking, multiband compressors, pitch correction, sync'ing to video..... let them pay for it.
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
I also got PT10 with my ElevenRack.

I think that's limited to 99 tracks & I need an Ilok..... but I think that's it. Well, there is that VST/RTAS thing, but not really a big deal.
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
Gizzmo0815 wrote:Nah, I disagree.

Artist is included with all of their interfaces, it's designed to be a scratch-pad, which it succeeds at admirably. And Producer is the comparatively priced "lite" version. The pricing is completely in line with the competitors. The difference is that Studio One Free is just that, completely free, while Artist is the intro version, Producer is lite and Pro is the full version.

Those that want unfettered VST support in Artist are asking Presonus to take a loss to satisfy them...this isn't good business, and would make little sense. You simply buy the product that allows you to achieve your goals, for your goals, Producer is the product...and the price is right in the ballpark for comparative options.

When I bought my MBox2 Pro, I got PTLE. 7.4 - no VST support, but full RTAS & Rewire support. Every Instrument I bought either installed an RTAS version, or fully supports rewire.

It also came with AbletonLive 8 Lite. Only 8 tracks total, and some limitations to how you can use the included instruments, but full VST & Rewire support.

The lite version of Samplitude only costs $49.99 You're limited to 16 bits, 64 tracks, 2 insert effects.

Think about it, if your instrument of choice is Scarbee's Vintage Piano, or Alicia's Keys & you want to record yourself, you can go get an 8 track, or 16 track recorder that won't interferer with your choice of instrument in any way or form.

You shouldn't expect to be able to produce polished tracks & as an artist, that's generally not your goal.

But with StudioOne Artist, I can make a pretty polished record & the limitations of VSTs can be worked around. I may be a good enough engineer/mixer, that I can do whatever I need with the included StudioOne effects. I can run as many tracks, busses, inputs, & outputs that I want.

Why would a single musician ever need to record more than a stereo pair? Why would a single musician need more than a stereo out? Or 8 insert effects, 8 effects sends? as many as 24 busses? If you're crafty enough, you can route 8 tracks of ADAT out & back into your studio & use any effects you want.

I'm not trying to start any trouble, just trying to help. I think there should be a product for musicians, supplying the features they "need" & once you start "dictating" what instruments they can use, you're pretty much infringing on that musician's creativity. Recording & arranging should be the focus. You should be able to record whatever you want, whether it be an upright piano, or a VSTi of an upright piano.

There should be another product for entry level studios, project studios. There should be additional features for editing, overdubing, routing. This is where you should go beyond CD quality sound, 24 bits 48K & up.

Then there should be the product for professionals. Increased routing, highest sampling rates, advanced disk management, support for industry standard formats, 64 bit memory access, pitch correction, sidechaining, networking features, etc...

Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
Jumping in again.

I can understand track limits...... 16 is more than I need. But other "lite" versions allow 32 (PTLE 7.4) or 48(Cubase Artist, Samplitude Music Studio)

I can understand audio input & output limits... again, an artist really shouldn't need more than 2 (recording a stereo mix off a mixer) but these other apps I've seen allow up to 8 inputs, 2 stereo outs.

Samplitude Music Studio limits you to two sends..... I don't need either. Two insert effects. I would say two plus EQ, there should be an EQ on every channel & two insert effects.

I don't have a lot of deal breakers, I can work around just about anything. But not being able to use the instruments I want to use, that's a deal breaker.
Studio One General Discussion » Studio One Artist vs. Pro » Go to message
I just wanted to get this off my chest.

I think disabling VST, AU, & Rewire support on the Artist version doesn't make a lot of sense. I'm an artist, all I want to do is write songs, capture song ideas, & communicate those ideas. My DAW should be nothing more than a scratch pad. But I should be able to use any instrument I want.

Nothing against the fine instruments included in StudioOne, but if my instrument of choice is NI's Kontakt or FM8 or Monark..... why shouldn't I be able to play them? Those are the instruments that spark my creativity. Those are the instruments I want to work with.

Or, if I'm one of those guys who use MPC Studio, how would I get my ideas from there to StudioOne?

Or if I'm a guitar player & I use GuitarRig.... sure studio one may have an comparable product..... but I want to use "my amp"

I've got Artist & these things limit me. I'm considering upgrading to Producer, but I'm not going to be using features like buses, sends., automation, I won't ever use half the effects, most likely won't use many of them at all..... I have no desire to mix or edit.

All I want to do is put together a basic demo that I can play for other artist where everyone can get a basic idea of where I'm at & we can all figure out where to go from there...... basically a rough demo.

Now, there are other options out there. Magix Music Studio. Full VST support, limited routing & effects. Just saying.
StudioLive General Discussion » Recomend for a songwriter » Go to message
If you were to recommend StudioOne to a songwriter, which features do you think (s)he would be most interested in?

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