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Drummer calls it quits!
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Big Joe Daddy
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Joined: 30/07/2010 01:24:03
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Location: Santa Ynez Valley, California
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Danny cat wrote:I am drummer of 20+ years and switched to IEM's a couple of years ago. I wouldn't go back to wedges if you paid me. I've always liked the processed sound drums have in the studio and that is one way of achieving that in a live setting. It helps that I mix monitors and FOH from stage so any adjustments are at arms length and the Buttkicker mounted on the throne gives you back the feeling of low-end. Sure you have to mic the whole kit (even cymbals) in a small venue but then you have everything there for a good board mix, not to mention saving my ears from the high-end of the snare drum and cymbals. I am cut-off from the band and the crowd as far as interaction goes but my primary purpose for playing is to sound as good as possible.


Hey Danny,
That's a great story. I assume you're playing an acoustic kit? Would you say the Buttkicker is worth the investment? Is the rest of your band running IEM's?
Thx,
BJD
StudioLive 24.4.2 | StudioLive 16.4.2 | StudioLive 16.0.2 | QSC K Series 10's, 12's, Subs | Fractal Axe-FX II | Mac Pro - OS X 10.7.4, 2.66 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon, 2TB RAID, 16GB | MacBook Pro | iPad 64GB | Studio One v2.5 | an old watch, a lamp, and a box of crayons
Jerryd
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Joined: 28/07/2010 16:01:24
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Big Joe -- did you ever fire up your system with the DR yet? I never heard back from you.
Danny cat
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Joined: 17/01/2011 11:04:41
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Good point about the room mics, you could use the talkback on the SL 16.4.2 as an ambient mic, even a nice condenser. I also have custom molds (Westone ES2's) which shut out everything but they fit better and are more comfortable than the earbuds. Any drummer wanting that extra bit of low end should seriously look into getting a Buttkicker to mount under their throne and a decent amp to power it with. Just curious, do your Ultimate Ears have dual drivers and what did they cost? Thanks.
Danny cat
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Joined: 17/01/2011 11:04:41
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Yes I play an acoustic kit and yes the Buttkicker is definitely worth the investment. I used an 18" subwoofer behind me for years but got tired of having to leave it at home if the drum riser couldn't accomodate it so I got the Buttkicker Concert. It has a 2ohm driver which is powered by one side of a Crown Microtech 2400 so it is getting about 1000w. You can tell the difference in how it feels by the quality of the amp behind it just like with speakers. I only paid $100 for the Buttkicker and the mounting bracket and you can use any amp available, I just hooked it up to various amplifiers and the 2400 seemed to literally "kick" the most. Hope this helps.
Big Joe Daddy
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Joined: 30/07/2010 01:24:03
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Location: Santa Ynez Valley, California
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Jerryd wrote:Big Joe -- did you ever fire up your system with the DR yet? I never heard back from you.

Hi Doc
I'm still here. I did finally get the DR connected and operating but I really didn't give it a chance to run it through its paces. Initially it sounded a little dull to me with some Steely Dan playing through it. I probably could have corrected it had I went to work on tweaking the eq. I don't have a very good speaker layout in my rehearsal room. The subs are in one corner and the tops are hanging from the ceiling.

I got so sidetracked with working on the PA that my efforts at polishing off a set list and honing my guitar licks got shoved to the back burner. The sound quality with the K Series was so good already I decided to leave the DR alone for a while and concentrate on the other stuff. I also got buried with the complexities of the Smaart software. I'll be ready to take another stab at it in the future but for now I needed to concentrate on the music.

Presently I'm working out a new guitar rig I'm putting together. I thought it would be simple but as usual I'm in deep. I've got a new Fractal Axe FX guitar modeler. It's definitely not plug and play, but when set up properly it's hard to top.
Anyway, I'll be back On the DR soon.
I'll keepnyou posted and thanks again for all your help.
BJD
StudioLive 24.4.2 | StudioLive 16.4.2 | StudioLive 16.0.2 | QSC K Series 10's, 12's, Subs | Fractal Axe-FX II | Mac Pro - OS X 10.7.4, 2.66 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon, 2TB RAID, 16GB | MacBook Pro | iPad 64GB | Studio One v2.5 | an old watch, a lamp, and a box of crayons
Jerryd
Presonic

Joined: 28/07/2010 16:01:24
Messages: 698
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Big Joe Daddy wrote:
Jerryd wrote:Big Joe -- did you ever fire up your system with the DR yet? I never heard back from you.

Hi Doc
I'm still here. I did finally get the DR connected and operating but I really didn't give it a chance to run it through its paces. Initially it sounded a little dull to me with some Steely Dan playing through it. I probably could have corrected it had I went to work on tweaking the eq. I don't have a very good speaker layout in my rehearsal room. The subs are in one corner and the tops are hanging from the ceiling.

I got so sidetracked with working on the PA that my efforts at polishing off a set list and honing my guitar licks got shoved to the back burner. The sound quality with the K Series was so good already I decided to leave the DR alone for a while and concentrate on the other stuff. I also got buried with the complexities of the Smaart software. I'll be ready to take another stab at it in the future but for now I needed to concentrate on the music.

Presently I'm working out a new guitar rig I'm putting together. I thought it would be simple but as usual I'm in deep. I've got a new Fractal Axe FX guitar modeler. It's definitely not plug and play, but when set up properly it's hard to top.
Anyway, I'll be back On the DR soon.
I'll keepnyou posted and thanks again for all your help.
BJD



Hey Joe -- could be a number of things. When inside -- if you move the sub away from the top where it was initially aligned at -- the phased aligned XO goes out the window. If the tops are placed near a wall or a ceiling -- you get strong reflections that can cancel frequencies out.

The best way would have been to take a snapshot of the original set up with NO Driverack in the chain. Note any areas of interest and then insert the 260 into the chain with everything bypassed internally. If the original snapshot of the K Series speakers stays the same -- then it is safe to move forward.

If the mere fact that the 260 got inserted into the chain and it totally changed the response even though all features internally on the 260 were bypassed (EQ's, Limiters, AFS....etc) -- then we have a signal issue or a gain structure issue.

In any case -- I commend you for having the guts to try. When you get everything else squared away let me know and maybe we can just use a different computer or a different version of Smaart and go thru it again.

It has to be something that we left out.........

Jerry D.
nanofuentes
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Joined: 23/11/2010 00:36:43
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Location: lincoln park michigan
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i would def. say get the buttkicker... or even better just run a bassamp next to him that way he can do a double mix.. i do that with my drummer n he loves it.. i love using IEMs if i want more of a feel i just usualy leave one in and the other loose that way i can still hear off the wedges on stage it works well... good luck my friend i know how it is with the "superstar" syndrom as i like to call it.. but some people just want to be loud on stage and that kills the sound big time
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