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Splitting audio signal into two mixers?
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foreigndude
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I apologize if this has been covered a billion times, but I don't even know how to search for this effectively.

Can I send my instruments' audio signals to my SL 16.0.2. as well as to another mixer without attenuating the sound dramatically? If so, how?

What I am trying to accomplish is this...my band is playing a bigger venue next month and they have their own PA and a sound guy, which is great, but, the guy doesn't have the ability to track (record) our show, which is my ultimate goal. We are also used to using our in-ear monitors (from the 4 auxes on the console). Ideally, what I would love to be able to do is plug ourselves into our SL 16.0.2., use our in-ears as we always do, BUT additionally, send the separate signals to the venue's FOH PA system as well. Their sound guy would control the FOH, I would control the monitors and actual tracking.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 23/06/2014 21:13:12

matthewgorman
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XLR splitters? Should I assume that you have your own snake? Split the signal at the stage box, and send one input to FOH, and one to your board. Run the IEM's from there.

There may be a more elegant solution, but that's the first thing I could think of.
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foreigndude
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matthewgorman wrote:XLR splitters? Should I assume that you have your own snake? Split the signal at the stage box, and send one input to FOH, and one to your board. Run the IEM's from there.

There may be a more elegant solution, but that's the first thing I could think of.


I do not have a snake at the moment, but getting one would be an option. One like this? http://goo.gl/ndQhfe
salvadoredelle
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the 1602 does not have direct outputs sub groups or inserts so the only way to do it is an outboard xlr splitter.

or just give the house a stereo send CR output... sound guy will love that!

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foreigndude
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salvadoredelle wrote:the 1602 does not have direct outputs sub groups or inserts so the only way to do it is an outboard xlr splitter.

or just give the house a stereo send CR output... sound guy will love that!



Thanks for the response. A splitter like this? http://goo.gl/ndQhfe
Sending just the outputs to the sound guy...I'm sure he'd love to get paid for pushing the mains up and down all night

SwitchBack
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Two things to keep an eye on with those hard-wired (transformerless) splitters:
- be very careful about which mixer will provide the phantom power, and on which channels. 48 volts in the wrong place can be destructive.
- all sources will have to drive two inputs in parallel. For some mics the combined input impedance can cause problems. Check specs of mics and mixers.
foreigndude
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SwitchBack wrote:Two things to keep an eye on with those hard-wired (transformerless) splitters:
- be very careful about which mixer will provide the phantom power, and on which channels. 48 volts in the wrong place can be destructive.
- all sources will have to drive two inputs in parallel. For some mics the combined input impedance can cause problems. Check specs of mics and mixers.


Phantom power for what? We aren't using any condenser mics and in our usual setup, Phantom power is off on all channels.
roblof
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foreigndude wrote:
SwitchBack wrote:Two things to keep an eye on with those hard-wired (transformerless) splitters:
- be very careful about which mixer will provide the phantom power, and on which channels. 48 volts in the wrong place can be destructive.
- all sources will have to drive two inputs in parallel. For some mics the combined input impedance can cause problems. Check specs of mics and mixers.


Phantom power for what? We aren't using any condenser mics and in our usual setup, Phantom power is off on all channels.

Yes, but the FoH mixer can still output phantom power by accident or they may want to use some of their equipment for some reason.

Don't you use di-boxes or are they passive?
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foreigndude
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roblof wrote:
foreigndude wrote:
SwitchBack wrote:Two things to keep an eye on with those hard-wired (transformerless) splitters:
- be very careful about which mixer will provide the phantom power, and on which channels. 48 volts in the wrong place can be destructive.
- all sources will have to drive two inputs in parallel. For some mics the combined input impedance can cause problems. Check specs of mics and mixers.


Phantom power for what? We aren't using any condenser mics and in our usual setup, Phantom power is off on all channels.

Yes, but the FoH mixer can still output phantom power by accident or they may want to use some of their equipment for some reason.

Don't you use di-boxes or are they passive?


OK, I get it. We are 'standard' 5 piece band (el. guitar, bass, keyboards, drums, vocal), only the keyboardist uses a DI box currently. Trying to get the two guitarists to use it as well, but that's a problem for itself.
roblof
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What are you using for the drums overhead? They are almost never dynamic mics. The hihat usually likes a small condeser mic as well...
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foreigndude
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roblof wrote:What are you using for the drums overhead? They are almost never dynamic mics. The hihat usually likes a small condeser mic as well...


Yeah, you're right...I think my whole idea is going down in flames because of that now. I actually do not know. The club also provides their microphones for the drums, which might be partially condensers.

So let's assume we will have some condensers. Where does this put me?
roblof
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I'd opt for this one.

http://artproaudio.com/art_products/audio_solutions/splitters_patchbays/product/s8-3way/

They also have a 2-way version but I like the extra split option.

You can also solder a snake split so it contains protective capacitors for the 'slave' console. However snakes go bad from time to time so a hardware unit is the way to go in my opinion.

Additionally some tech may refuse you to connect a split-snake to protect their own equipment and may require you to use a proper splitter.
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talmen
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Check with the house sound person. If their board has direct outs or unused insert points, you can use those to feed your SL for recording. Then all you need to do is get the appropriate cables/adapters to get the job done.
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roblof
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talmen wrote:Check with the house sound person. If their board has direct outs or unused insert points, you can use those to feed your SL for recording. Then all you need to do is get the appropriate cables/adapters to get the job done.

As the OP is using his studiolive primarily to feed iem's, using the direct outs for tapping the signal from the FoH console can create a big issue since the headamp gain is shared and controlled by the FoH engineer.
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SwitchBack
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foreigndude wrote:
roblof wrote:What are you using for the drums overhead? They are almost never dynamic mics. The hihat usually likes a small condeser mic as well...


Yeah, you're right...I think my whole idea is going down in flames because of that now. I actually do not know. The club also provides their microphones for the drums, which might be partially condensers.

So let's assume we will have some condensers. Where does this put me?

You can still go with the hard-wired splitter. In most cases it is a better solution than sharing gain settings between two mixers. But like I said, agree with the FOH engineer on who will provide phantom power for those split channels (where needed). 2 good reasons for using the SL for this:
- being the monitor mixer it is probably closer to the stage (and the loads) than the FOH mixer.
- the SL has a phantom power switch on each individual channel. Not all mixers have that luxury.

To avoid the risk of frying something: don't mix mic inputs, line inputs and inserts on those splits. 48V into anything but another mic input is almost certainly going to do damage.

You will lose a few dB on the splits due to the lower combined input impedance. The combined input impedance of two mic inputs can be as low as 375 Ohms depending on the FOH mixer used. With some sources that will not only affect the signal level into each preamp but also affect sound quality. So do check the specs of the mics and DIs.
 
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