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FR: Tempo Detection and Mapping Feature Request
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dr4kan
Presonic
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Joined: 25/08/2013 13:40:40
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absolutely necessary for me. a big . I am pretty sure they will implement it in v3, but then, when?
System: Mac i7, 16 GB ram, 2 x SSD Samsung 840 Pro 256 GB + 1 x SSD Samsung 840 Pro 512 GB + 2 X 2TB HDD (backup), OSX 10.8.4

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vincentlepes
Prenoob

Joined: 26/11/2013 02:42:24
Messages: 3
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I'll go back and read all of this soon to see if anyone posted workarounds. I am currently really needing this feature to full transition from Live to Studio One. In my quest I made a quick little video showing how it is done in Live.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDSU61ppTTM

I'm sad to hear this isn't a feature, so add me to the list of people beckoning for it!
jpettit
Presonoid
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Joined: 13/01/2011 23:44:45
Messages: 2211
Location: Portland Oregon
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Just manual tempo mapping via dragging tempo change events in tempo map (Which is a good technique to learn anyway as most auto detect beat maps require you to go in a tweak the timing if the song ia s live performance.)

http://forumsarchive.presonus.com/posts/list/32226.page
My Website
FRs: Tempo Detection & Mapping
Training Videos: Advance Melodyne, Creating Macros, 2.5 New Features, Signal Flow, Audio Timing Drum Replacement, Tempo Mapping, Useful Macros, Transformations, Layer/Takes/Comps
Simultaneous Audio Interfaces: Audiobox 1818VSL, RME 9632, Line 6 UX2, HF Presonus HP-60
DAWs: Studio One Pro 2.6.1, Reaper 4.5, Sonar X3c Pro, Adobe Audition CS5
Computer: OS:Win7 64-bit, Core i7 950, ASUS P6X58D Premium, 12GB DDR3 1600, GeForce GTX 470 (for CUDA) ,SSD Boot & Cache drives, 1 Tera 7200 RPM SATA II Audio & Video drives, UAD-2 x2
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vincentlepes
Prenoob

Joined: 26/11/2013 02:42:24
Messages: 3
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Thanks, I watched your videos and your workaround is very helpful...but so slow compared to what I'm used to .

I have a question about your method. I notice you use a macro to drop in 16 tempo changes at a time. Would it be easier to work big to small? What I mean is, you could play the song through and count the measures. Then use two tempo changes at the beginning and end to get the whole song starting and ending in the right place based on that number. Next go to about halfway through the song, and add a tempo change there...keep going in the middle of each change until you're close enough. That way you are dragging half the song, quarter of the song, so on and so forth until you get to whatever resolution is good enough that it all matches up, and then you make a final pass for small adjustments. Sometimes Ableton chokes when beat-detecting a song, like if the tempo is odd or the musicians are syncopated, and I use this method instead of relying on it to do the lifting. It still works out faster than measure by measure. Let me know what you think .

I'm hoping more people rally behind this feature request, it's a big deal to certain workflows and I use it for at least three very regular functions: mapping out a song to learn to play it by section (e.g. it's easy to grab just the bridge if it's on the grid); allowing a drummer to sway the time and overdubbing other instruments to the drums while still providing loop punch-in and the option of a metronome; and recording something live without a click and using the grid to apply different EQ or effects as needed per section. I also saw in your videos you had a few good uses as well...and while your method does the job, in most cases I can do it in Ableton in just a few seconds.

Thanks for putting together the great videos and threads on this topic and raising awareness to Presonus that this is such a useful feature!
vincentlepes
Prenoob

Joined: 26/11/2013 02:42:24
Messages: 3
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Since you outlined a lot of other DAWs, here are some things I can do with warping in Ableton that would make great additions to the feature set of Studio One. I may be asking a lot since this feature doesn't even exist yet, but since Ableton was aimed at electronic producers and DJs, they took beat matching capabilities further than most DAWs (to my knowledge). Perhaps the competition can do these things, but that's all the more reason S1 should catch up on this essential workflow feature.

  • If the preference is set to do so, clips are automatically filled with warp markers (beat detected) on import. You can also decide in what manner they are warped by default.

  • There are two types of warp markers in Ableton. If you drag a gray warp marker, it warps all unwarped audio after that point based on the adjustment you made (you warp the whole song or the remainder if you have already placed markers). This is a great way to get the whole song in the ballpark of the grid to start off. If you double click a gray marker you get a yellow marker. These markers only adjust the audio between each other. If you drag a gray marker that lies between two yellow markers, it becomes a yellow marker. Yellow markers are like fixed tempo adjustments while gray markers are elastic. It's hard to explain this without doing it, but it's SO useful when you have to do manual edits. Gray markers will move around based on other warps where yellow markers hold their ground.

  • A clip set to master will control the tempo of the DAW and all other warped "slave" clips will follow as well. You can adjust the warp markers in the master and it fluctuates the tempo map accordingly without changing the playback of the master clip at all.

  • Once you have the DAW tempo following a master clip, you can double-click the automation lane for tempo and it will commit the tempo changes to the master, making them adjustable. At this point the master clip is once again a slave and you can warp it if you want to make changes, for example to smooth out a tempo transition or adjust a mistake without locking into a fixed tempo grid.

  • You can warp a few measures to get in the ballpark and use an option called "Warp from here". It will adjust the rest of the song based on what you did manually and not undo any of your edits.

  • There is also a "warp from here straight" function that does the same as above but keeps the tempo even from where you started.


  • There are actually more features than this in Live...but the PDC issues in Live are killing my recording/mix work (phase problems abound) and that's why I'm over here begging Presonus to catch up.
    Kiwicomposer
    Presonic
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    Joined: 02/12/2011 15:38:39
    Messages: 284
    Location: Wellington, New Zealand
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    All I will say is 3 Thumbs up for this one.
    Steve Currington
    de Composer
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Twitter: @kiwicomposer
    Facebook: kiwicomposer
    SkypeID: kiwicomposer
    ----------------------------------------

    Primary Hardware: Presonus Studio One v2.6.2, Presonus Audiobox1818vsl, Presonus Audiobox USB, Presonus Faderport, Focusrite Liquid Saffire 56, MOTU Traveler Mk3, TC-Helicon VoiceworksPlus, FMR RNC, FMR RNLA, Axiom Pro 49 Keyboard, other sundry hardware, numerous mics, audio plugins and instruments.
    Primary Software: Sibelius v7.x, Notion v4.x, Logic Studio. V9.x., Melodyne Editor.

    Running on iMac's and MacBookAir with OSX 10.9.x Mavericks

    Kiwicomposer
    Presonic
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    Joined: 02/12/2011 15:38:39
    Messages: 284
    Location: Wellington, New Zealand
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    3 Thumbs Up is all I will say
    Seems to be a lot f support for this request.
    Steve Currington
    de Composer
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Twitter: @kiwicomposer
    Facebook: kiwicomposer
    SkypeID: kiwicomposer
    ----------------------------------------

    Primary Hardware: Presonus Studio One v2.6.2, Presonus Audiobox1818vsl, Presonus Audiobox USB, Presonus Faderport, Focusrite Liquid Saffire 56, MOTU Traveler Mk3, TC-Helicon VoiceworksPlus, FMR RNC, FMR RNLA, Axiom Pro 49 Keyboard, other sundry hardware, numerous mics, audio plugins and instruments.
    Primary Software: Sibelius v7.x, Notion v4.x, Logic Studio. V9.x., Melodyne Editor.

    Running on iMac's and MacBookAir with OSX 10.9.x Mavericks

    jpettit
    Presonoid
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    Joined: 13/01/2011 23:44:45
    Messages: 2211
    Location: Portland Oregon
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    Yes even promised by Ex Studio One Product Manager. http://forumsarchive.presonus.com/posts/list/45/18562.page#270094

    @vincentlepes
    My experience after doing this for 5 years in three different DAWs is it works best to work for the start of the song to the end.

    Read the entire thread and you will see me talking about Zplane.
    Their code is licensed and is the same code that Abelton Live uses.

    Let's hope Presonus does the same as they already license Elastique Audio.
    My Website
    FRs: Tempo Detection & Mapping
    Training Videos: Advance Melodyne, Creating Macros, 2.5 New Features, Signal Flow, Audio Timing Drum Replacement, Tempo Mapping, Useful Macros, Transformations, Layer/Takes/Comps
    Simultaneous Audio Interfaces: Audiobox 1818VSL, RME 9632, Line 6 UX2, HF Presonus HP-60
    DAWs: Studio One Pro 2.6.1, Reaper 4.5, Sonar X3c Pro, Adobe Audition CS5
    Computer: OS:Win7 64-bit, Core i7 950, ASUS P6X58D Premium, 12GB DDR3 1600, GeForce GTX 470 (for CUDA) ,SSD Boot & Cache drives, 1 Tera 7200 RPM SATA II Audio & Video drives, UAD-2 x2
    [WWW]
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    Presonic
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    Joined: 13/01/2011 11:42:59
    Messages: 825
    Location: denmark
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    yes please
    http://soundcloud.com/subbasednb
    FACEBOOK
    http://www.facebook.com/Subbasednb

    Frigt Teck Sounddesign
    http://www.teamdnr.net/distorted-drums/
    SHOW YOUR SUPPORT BUY MY SAMPLEPACK
    jpettit
    Presonoid
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    Joined: 13/01/2011 23:44:45
    Messages: 2211
    Location: Portland Oregon
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    Didn't realize that Digital Performer had such a wide array of beat and tempo detection tools as well.
    http://vimeo.com/81498577
    Let's hope V3 has out done them all interns of accuracy and ease of use.

    My Website
    FRs: Tempo Detection & Mapping
    Training Videos: Advance Melodyne, Creating Macros, 2.5 New Features, Signal Flow, Audio Timing Drum Replacement, Tempo Mapping, Useful Macros, Transformations, Layer/Takes/Comps
    Simultaneous Audio Interfaces: Audiobox 1818VSL, RME 9632, Line 6 UX2, HF Presonus HP-60
    DAWs: Studio One Pro 2.6.1, Reaper 4.5, Sonar X3c Pro, Adobe Audition CS5
    Computer: OS:Win7 64-bit, Core i7 950, ASUS P6X58D Premium, 12GB DDR3 1600, GeForce GTX 470 (for CUDA) ,SSD Boot & Cache drives, 1 Tera 7200 RPM SATA II Audio & Video drives, UAD-2 x2
    [WWW]
    Bbd
    Presonoid
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    Joined: 01/08/2012 23:30:41
    Messages: 1244
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    DP has some great tools in this area!
    Bbd

    Studio One 2.6 Pro,, Steinberg UR-44, Zoom R24, Windows 7 64, AMD Phenom II X4 830 2.8 ghz 6 gig. ram, Axiom 61,Rhode M5's, Shure SH55, B1 Behringer, SM58, SM57, 70's Strat, Vox AC30,, Alexis MICTube Duo Preamp, Nano Patch Big Knob,
    Sonar X3 Pro, Pearl Drums, Ludwig Supraphonic Snare, Axiom 64, Ibanez Bass, Equator D5's
     
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