image description


In ear monitors in worship
  Forum Index » House of Worship 
Author
Message
darrellross
Prenoob

Joined: 19/12/2013 14:52:34
Messages: 2
Offline

Well hello again folks Darrell here to melt some minds....

I am wanting to get the best sound of my custom triple driver IEM's especially on the vocals but it still sounds muddy and can be all of the place. I have a 16.4.2 that we really only have room for mono IEM sends and at the minute I have some serious reverb and a short slap delay on the vocals to try and make them more clear!

Will ambient mics help much with this? I've just got some cheapo behringer c2's (not the greatest) but how much will this help? Anyone got any top tips to help? We have used the presets on the desk for eq with minor tweaking to suit the FOH, so I am unclear what else I can do to make this sound good? I would love to hear what a good mix sounds like mixed by a pro!
sjc193
Presonic
[Avatar]

Joined: 30/03/2012 20:51:58
Messages: 568
Location: Warren, PA
Offline

You may want to look into using the PRE2 setting in the system menu for the AUX's, if this is set to PRE1 then the EQ you apply to make it sound good for FOH will not be used in the in ears, but if it is set to PRE2 then it is used in the in ears (AUXes), there is a balancing act that must be used when using PRE2 though as any eq changes you make affect the muso's so you need tyo het it right quickly then don't mess with it.

Steve
StudioLive 16.4.2 in 10U + slant top OSP case
rackmount Windows 8 PC Quad core 8G ram
ASUS RT-N66U Dual Band Router
Ipad2 Wifi Griffin Survivor Case
Studio One 2.5 Pro
2 Turbosound TMS-1's (Mains)
2 OHM MR450D Subs with Kilomax 18inch drivers
2 Yamaha S115V's (for floor monitors),2 Yamaha BR 15's (for floor monitors)
3 Behringer 12" floor monitors
3 Behringer EP2500 amps, 1 QSC Amp
1 DBX Driverack 260
1 DBX 231S Graphic Eq
10 58/57 mics, 1 beta52 kick mic, 20 mic stands
2 e609 guitar amp mics
2 Radial J48 Active DI's
2 Blizzard Puck FAB 5 led lights
1 DMXIS usb to dmx controller
1 Temor 1 Alto 1 Soprano 1 Clarinet
1 Sheraton semi hollowbody electric
1 pedalboard with lots of pedals favorites are javaboost into tube screamer
1 Fender Deluxe Amp
2 Acoustic guitars, 1 elec bass, 1 acoustic bass, 1 bazooki
3 mixers and lots of other stuff I don't use in the closet
1 beer holder that clamps to the side of my mic stand with my stage name printed on it "Swingin' Steve"
TimmyP1955
Presonic
[Avatar]

Joined: 29/07/2010 08:42:15
Messages: 348
Location: Indianapolis
Offline

Reverb and delay may make the your vocals stand out, but they will sound less clear.

You need to compensate for the proximity boost of the microphone (commonly about 10dB up, centered around 200Hz), and for occlusion (how you sound to yourself when your ears are plugged. As was mentioned, running Pre2 may be a good option. Sometimes it helps (or hinders) if the polarity of your vocal channel is reversed (though that may have a detrimental effect in the house and in other folks IEMs).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 09/06/2014 04:50:11

http://www.padrick.net/TP_Audio.htm
SwitchBack
Presonoid
[Avatar]

Joined: 17/02/2011 01:10:03
Messages: 1428
Offline

You may even have to start with how the rest of the system is dialed in. Compressors on everything is one of the pitfalls of using mixers that have them. And for some reason the SL mixers don't like high input levels; 50% up the input meters seems to be where you want to be. Minimum use of compressors and conservative input levels will improve clarity. Oh, and use the high pass filters on all mic inputs. On the SL they're only 6dB/oct so you can set them pretty high before they really start to cut in.

One more thing when using mono IEMs: 2 or more microphones picking up the same source can cancel eachother out. So be selective in which mics you use for the iem mix. Also, where possible, use noise gates/expanders on the mics.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 20/05/2014 11:24:12

lowdbrent
Presonic
[Avatar]

Joined: 13/11/2010 22:17:51
Messages: 396
Offline

darrellross wrote:Well hello again folks Darrell here to melt some minds....

I am wanting to get the best sound of my custom triple driver IEM's especially on the vocals but it still sounds muddy and can be all of the place. I have a 16.4.2 that we really only have room for mono IEM sends and at the minute I have some serious reverb and a short slap delay on the vocals to try and make them more clear!

Will ambient mics help much with this? I've just got some cheapo behringer c2's (not the greatest) but how much will this help? Anyone got any top tips to help? We have used the presets on the desk for eq with minor tweaking to suit the FOH, so I am unclear what else I can do to make this sound good? I would love to hear what a good mix sounds like mixed by a pro!


Custom molds do not guarantee quality of sound unless you have been to an audiologist and the elements and curves have been designed to match your hearing. If you went and got fitted, or sent a kit in without being tested, it is entirely possible you have something that is not the best for your ears.

The last thing you should do is be adding reverb and delay to "make them clear". It does the opposite. Reverb will certainly make you feel less like you are singing with your fingers stuck in your ear canals. It can muddy things up.

Ambient mics will help with adding dimension to the sound, but if you room is crap, your mics are crap and the placement is crap, it will not help either. It sounds like you need to really get to a point where you can have a stereo mix. The stereo mix will allow you to have your vocals centered and your music hard panned L and R. This will help with localization and will clean things up dramatically. The best in ear mixes are not going to have the input sources dry, with no processing. On the flip side, you do not want what they are having to do to the input sources for the house mix. They are mixing over and above the acoustic noise created in the room. They may have something high passed super high because they only need the highs to round out what is coming from the stage, for example. Then you need EQ, compression and brick wall limiting to protect your hearing.

Inverting polarity is not going clear up vocals. Well, that's not the purpose of it. If it does clean up your vocals, you have huge issues elsewhere.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 02/06/2014 07:36:00

[Email]
 
Forum Index » House of Worship
Go to: